eDRUMin 1.5 BETA now available

[Dadwrshpdrum]

Firstly, the BT-1 *must* be on a stereo input in order for its crosstalk cancellation feature to work. If it's on a split input, then is can only operate in sensor mode and showing it linked it with a snare pad would be misleading.

Correct me if my assumption is wrong. When I read your posts “it’s crosstalk cancellation feature to work” I assume that means the built in switch within the BT-1 must be closed for the piezo signal to be used? Understood this requires a stereo connection, the switch signal and piezo signal.

I just took advantage of shutting off auto save and experimenting with the BT1. The feature worked great and made things so much easier. Thank you.

So I removed my splitter and connected the BT1 stereo cable directly to the eDRUMin input. I then reset the input to stereo connection and a BT1 type pad. First, the Xtalk mode worked very well. I liked the input link button and how it functions. The app told me I wasn’t linked and when I selected the button then the inputs highlighted that I could select. Very easy and intuitive. I whacked away on the snare (rim and head) and there was zero cross talk to the BT1. I would have suspected this based on the internal switch within the BT1. I whacked away on the BT1 and zero cross talk to the snare. This is the real benefit of the 1.5, because previously there was some cross talk between the BT1 and snare rim. It looked like the lowest velocity in Xtalk mode was 30ish. When I tapped lightly on the BT1 I got zero notes, but I could see the spikes in the far left scrolling window (not sure what you call that).

I then switched to sensor mode. I noticed the link to input option disappeared. I was not aware of that last night when I wrote my original post. Hence some confusion I’m sure. I made an assumption the link to input was available in Xtalk mode AND sensor mode. The full dynamics of the BT1 came back, but also the cross talk. I don’t know how this is done or what is going on under the hood. However, is it possible to get the linked to input / cross talk cancellation benefits while in sensor mode? Can I keep the BT1 sensitive dynamics but cancel out the cross talk to and from the snare? That would be the game changer and if requires a stereo connection (not split like my normal setup) I’m okay with that.

[Rob]

I don’t know how this is done or what is going on under the hood. However, is it possible to get the linked to input / cross talk cancellation benefits while in sensor mode? Can I keep the BT1 sensitive dynamics but cancel out the cross talk to and from the snare? That would be the game changer and if requires a stereo connection (not split like my normal setup) I’m okay with that.

Yes and no. In sensor mode, I could make it that so when you hit the BT-1 hard enough to activate the switch it prevents the snare from triggering, but that's it. Hits to the rim of the snare and even parts of the head would still cause the BT-1 to trigger. Also light hits to the BT-1 could cause the snare to trigger. I felt that in the end this would simply create more technical support work for me. Perhaps in the future with some much deeper processing where all three piezo signals are compared, this could work. The way it is, I think I've implemented it the way Roland intended it to be implemented, and that's a pretty good start. Besides, the current method has the advantage that the BT-1 and the HIT / RS of the snare can be triggered simultaneously--not a bad tradeoff.

[Dadwrshpdrum]

Yes and no. In sensor mode, I could make it that so when you hit the BT-1 hard enough to activate the switch it prevents the snare from triggering, but that's it. Hits to the rim of the snare and even parts of the head would still cause the BT-1 to trigger. Also light hits to the BT-1 could cause the snare to trigger.

All good points. I think adding to sensor mode an inhibit from the snare triggering would be a great enhancement. In 1.4 I got most of the xtalk removed in sensor mode on the PD-125BK with a minor increase in xtalk cancellation (from 10 to 16). I felt like going higher was diminishing returns because only the big hits on the BT1 caused the rim to miss trigger. At least for my set up the small hits on BT1 are not an issue on the snare.

I was experimenting just now by increasing the xtalk amount on the BT1 until the miss triggers were gone. I got to 34. The playability of the BT1 was excellent and only the biggest rimshot right next to the BT1 caused a miss trigger.

Edit: my judgement on playability is not an expert level. I use BT1 for side stick and use a normal MDS-compact rack. I played quick 1/16th notes lightly on the BT1 with 1/4 note kicks. I didn’t have any issues. I also played a beat with the HH, kick and side stick (accent and ghost notes), again with no issues. Playing a light double stroke roll on the BT1 with a kick beat maybe some notes dropped…

Without knowing how it works it seems like if I could set the BT1 xtalk amount, but that high amount only be applicable to linked input (snare) signal. Otherwise for all other signals the BT1 xtalk amount is just the default amount, 10, I think…. Those are my 2 cents.

[monospace]

So the only reason to explicitly select BT-1 as a trigger type is to access Xtalk Mode, correct?
Because I’m noticing no difference in responsiveness between Sensor mode, or mono/dual mono, or even regular rubber pad trigger settings.

[Rob]

That is correct. The icon is different of course, but functionality no difference.

[monospace]

Cool cool. I’m keeping it at BT-1 Sensor then because I’m a sucker for proper icons. Thanks.

[Dadwrshpdrum]

https://www.audiofront.net/eDRUMin_Cont ... .5.0.2.zip
https://www.audiofront.net/eDRUMin_Cont ... .5.0.2.zip

If you previously updated an ED10 with build 0 or 1, you will need to reset your 2nd pedal input. Sorry.

Changes in build 1

• Fixed firmware update issue with 2nd pedal input.
• Fixed UI layout issues for BT-1 on a split input.
• UI fixes for split inputs

I just updated to 1.5.0.2. I had autosense off before the update. Both of pedals came back good with one minor exception on input 1 (the VH10). Gain, xtalk, min and S Sense seemed to have reset back to default. The note bank and linked to the cymbal was all good plus the advanced options. Input 2 (alesis RealHat pedal) came back with no issues. Still looked like a Boss Fs-6, just the way I wanted it.

The UI layout issues looked to be fixed. I did notice one more bug. I saw it in 1.5.0.1 just a few minutes before I updated. Same set up with a split input (left hand side a KD-10 rubber pad and right hand side a BT-1), but I have auto select off. While I’m viewing the BT1, and I hit the kick the MIDI note for the BT1 lights up (doesn’t play, just the graphic in the bottom right of UI). Same thing if I select the KD10 rubber pad to view and hit the BT1. The MIDI note for “HIT” lights up, but that note doesn’t actually play. And as I was typing this to make sure I got this right…I noticed the velocity number shows the velocity of the split input as well. So it is not just the HIT midi note that lights up, but the velocity number shows the other pad’s velocity. Note: the velocity curve does not change, just the number.

Edit: autoselect not autosense for the MIDI note and velocity number observations.

[Rob]

he UI layout issues looked to be fixed. I did notice one more bug. I saw it in 1.5.0.1 just a few minutes before I updated. Same set up with a split input (left hand side a KD-10 rubber pad and right hand side a BT-1), but I have auto select off. While I’m viewing the BT1, and I hit the kick the MIDI note for the BT1 lights up (doesn’t play, just the graphic in the bottom right of UI). Same thing if I select the KD10 rubber pad to view and hit the BT1. The MIDI note for “HIT” lights up, but that note doesn’t actually play. And as I was typing this to make sure I got this right…I noticed the velocity number shows the velocity of the split input as well. So it is not just the HIT midi note that lights up, but the velocity number shows the other pad’s velocity. Note: the velocity curve does not change, just the number.

Confirmed and fixed. This bug is in version 1.4 as well. Thanks.

[Dadwrshpdrum]

Another bug to report, likely not unique to 1.5.0.2 but that was the version I’m on. I was trying to dial in my two PDX-12 pads so I could provide a good screenshot of my settings to another post about settings for PDX-12. I noticed in 1.4 I never dialed in the tom’s SS and RS velocity curves (inputs are stereo) so I wanted to get that done. I had autoselect on, and velocity curves selected not note banks. With the cursor I can flip through Hit, SS, and RS no problem. Until I hit the SS (or RS) to autoselect that velocity curve. Sometimes on the first hit the curve looks right and the IND checkbox indicates correctly. But in subsequent hits (or sometimes on the first hit) the velocity curve flips to the HIT velocity curve and IND checkbox is incorrect (for example should be checked as independent, but is unchecked). Also continuing to hit the SS in this example the velocity curve will cycle somtimes each hit or after multiple hits. Hitting other pads and then coming right back, using autoselect to the SS (or RS) does not seem to help. You have to go to another pad, using autoselect, and back to head of the original pad then use the cursor to select SS or RS to get the correct velocity curve.

Also once this issue occurs, autoselect to the SS, for example, but wrong velocity curve, I try to use cursor to select another velocity curve (like HIT or RS) the cursor does not work. Latched to SS, in this example. Same thing if latched to RS, but then I can’t select SS and Hit.

That’s why to clear the issue you have to autoselect another pad, and then autoselect back to the head of original pad (not the SS or RS). Then use the cursor to select SS or RS.

I just checked and ride cymbal does not have this issue (I use bell sense and single stereo connection).

[monospace]

Minor bug: numerical values on GUI are not updating in real time. I have to click away from the input first, and then move back to see my changes. I've noticed this when using the mouse wheel to change Gain & Thresh sliders, as well as various scaler wheels.

EDIT: I should clarify that this only occurs with really small changes in the decimal range, the kind you would use a mouse wheel for. I can see the slider/wheel move on the GUI, but the numbers don't update until I move away and come back.