eDRUMin 10 Revision 2 Information

[hang12]

The changes are small and most users wouldn't notice a difference unless they are using a VH-13 or VH-12 or a hall effect sensor that needs power from the pedal input. There are no changes to the trigger circuitry.

Could you quantify the difference, for a VH-12 owner, as I have two relatively new rev 1 hardware versions of the eDRUMin10?
Is this something that can be modified in the firmware for a resolution tweak via a e.g. 'VH-12 preset' checkbox?
Or is it radical enough to send hardware back, or swap out?

[Rob]

So I'll try to explain. Whenever the eDRUMin measures the position of the hihat pedal, it gets a value between 0 and 1023 (10 bit). There's always noise in that measurement. On ED10 the noise is about +- 5. That means the ED10 can only be sure the position of the pedal has changed when the measured value changes by more than 5. On ED10R2, the opamp buffer drops the noise down to about +-2, meaning that the value only needs to change by 2 before it can be sure the pedal position has really changed. The net effect is that ED10R2 can detect smaller (more subtle) changes in the pedal position. ED10 can not be upgraded to add this functionality nor can a firmware update magically remove noise from analog signals. ED10 already does a great job of tracking the hihat position, ED10R2 just does it a tiny bit better.

[jacko]

.ED10 already does a great job of tracking the hihat position...

i use the 'old' ED10 with an FD9 and CY5 to SD3 and can confirm this

[edrumuser]

65drums had a great review, but eDrumWorshop has a newer review that may interest you.

https://youtu.be/P3S0IMYA1Zo

If you asking about percussion sets with Roland modules so you can increase the number of pads and zones of a Roland module. Roland removed that feature starting with TD-50 so that means TD-27 and TD-17 does not have the feature. The newer Roland modules are constrained to the total number of zones for whatever single channel of MIDI you choose. So if you set your new Roland module to Channel 11 and eDRUMin to channel 11 you still have the total number of zones in the Roland module as if you had left it in the standard Channel 10.

The eDrumWorskhop has other videos on his channel that goes over this as well. Also I think 65drums or vdrum tips on YouTube has videos talking about the bad decision of Roland dropping percussion sets from their newest flagship modules.

If you are happy with the number of zones in your newer Roland module and you just want the ability to split your two zone Toms into two one zone pads without needing a drum splitter, eDRUMin is a great option.

That is what I’ve done on my TD-17. Before eDRUMin I had split Tom 2 into two single zone Toms (added a fourth Tom), and I was using the cable snake with a drum splitter for Tom 2. Now with eDRUMin I use USB MIDI in on TD-17 from the USB Host Port on eDRUMin 10. All of my Toms are two zone now when I use a VST, but I have an eDRUMin note bank just for TD-17 that goes back to single zone Tom 2 and single zone Tom 4.

hey, thank you for your reply,

i don't know nothing about percussion sets but i know for sure that , for example, the TD 25 "don't have" the feature showsed on the following video
" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WI9jQRKtQTA "

On that video you are able to SETUP daisy chain "expansions" between roland td17 and roland td27... BUT a mandatory requisite ios that you have to SET midi channel when midi IN is in use...

the slave module send all midi data to the master module but in different midi channel.

for what i have understand IF, you are not able to DEFINE the midi channel , you are not able to daisy chain modules.

Now, my question is:

I can define the Midi channel for midi OUT of emidiin10 to be send data ON CHANNEL 11 ?.

thank you.

[Rob]

.
Now, my question is:

I can define the Midi channel for midi OUT of emidiin10 to be send data ON CHANNEL 11 ?.

thank you.

Yes.

[hang12]

So I'll try to explain. Whenever the eDRUMin measures the position of the hihat pedal, it gets a value between 0 and 1023 (10 bit). There's always noise in that measurement. On ED10 the noise is about +- 5. That means the ED10 can only be sure the position of the pedal has changed when the measured value changes by more than 5. On ED10R2, the opamp buffer drops the noise down to about +-2, meaning that the value only needs to change by 2 before it can be sure the pedal position has really changed. The net effect is that ED10R2 can detect smaller (more subtle) changes in the pedal position. ED10 can not be upgraded to add this functionality nor can a firmware update magically remove noise from analog signals. ED10 already does a great job of tracking the hihat position, ED10R2 just does it a tiny bit better.

Ok - thanks for quantifying. Seeing how the HH output is typically 7 bit MIDI (and typically is slightly 'chunky', i.e. linear but skipping values depending on the scanning situ and rapidity of foot movement), the noise difference between rev 1 and rev 2 for this functional aspect - shouldn't make a difference.
I don't know what the position resolution between a direct VH-12 to TD-20's 'HH foot pedal' input hookup is, but it will still all be limited to 7 bit MIDI resolution using the eDRUMin. Since I'll be using SD3 mostly, that's one more thing limited to 128 steps as well.
So I guess I won't be boxing up one of my eDRUMin-10's - that's good news. btw I think the eDRUMin scans my HH well enough - just needed to ask since the VH-12 was mentioned as possibly being optimized... just a bit more.

[hang12]

.ED10 already does a great job of tracking the hihat position...

i use the 'old' ED10 with an FD9 and CY5 to SD3 and can confirm this

The VH-12 has a much smaller calibration range than the FD series - I have a FD-7 as well. The VH-12 is (off hand) maybe 25% of the whole available calibration range. But even if it is a 1/4 of the entire possible range, the V2 vs V1 noise improvement should still hopefully fall within the overall scheme of 7 bit resolution control, if it starts out as 10 bit detection. I'll have to pull out the FD-7 and A/B it vs the VH-12 to try to see what the difference is.
And also maybe compare both to the direct VH-12 to TD-20 hook-up (which I'm trying to avoid using, as I'd just like to stay with the eDRUMin's)

[edrumuser]

.
Now, my question is:

I can define the Midi channel for midi OUT of emidiin10 to be send data ON CHANNEL 11 ?.

thank you.

Yes.

perfect ... awsome... superb...
ok, i'll buy it immediatly..

thank you!!.


UPDATE:

Mr, Rob.. i understand just now that you are the owner of Audiofront, Sorry for that .

Rob, probably i have completely misunderstood what this module is for...
this is my last question, i promise.

i just want to expand my drumset with edrum10 module but i want to be completely sure that work the way i hope.

this is what i want to achieve:

I want to configure your module to trigger 2 additional toms "2x Roland Acoustic Design PDA 140F Floor Tom" and some other pads...
i know that i can use edrum10 to trigger VST like SD3 or others, just connect edrum10 and td27 to the computer and use midi learn to trigger pads/sound BUT... my primary intention is to trigger TD27 internal drumkit.

My td27 is full now and i use splitters to add 1 tom and 1 crash.

in one video review of edrum10 on youtube i read on the comment section that is not possible to ADD triggers to the td27 in standalone mode and that a lot of people have misunderstood this.

is this right ?.

thank you.

[digiface]

Hi, is there a current best or great performing hihat and also ride recommendation using ED10v2 and SD3? IE the least money, but not limited, new or used, to get as much open/close and bow/edge/bell sensing etc reliably with SD3 as possible? Or not I don't know, just throwing it out there. I saw a few posts about SD (maybe 2 and not 3 and/or maybe ED10v1 and not v2?) losing track or playing wrong notes .

I prefer hihat on a proper stand but I dont care really if the disconnected FD type set up actually works better in reality.

EDIT:

Can it be confirmed by anyone whether using any of VH-10/11/12 or 13 with the ED10v2 and SD3 does NOT have losing track of notes or velocities issues?

From what I've read the yamaha PCY155 seems to be good as a ride (and cheap) with SD3 but stuck on the right hi hat to get.

[Dadwrshpdrum]

.
Now, my question is:

I can define the Midi channel for midi OUT of emidiin10 to be send data ON CHANNEL 11 ?.

thank you.

Yes.

perfect ... awsome... superb...
ok, i'll buy it immediatly..

thank you!!.


UPDATE:

Mr, Rob.. i understand just now that you are the owner of Audiofront, Sorry for that .

Rob, probably i have completely misunderstood what this module is for...
this is my last question, i promise.

i just want to expand my drumset with edrum10 module but i want to be completely sure that work the way i hope.

this is what i want to achieve:

I want to configure your module to trigger 2 additional toms "2x Roland Acoustic Design PDA 140F Floor Tom" and some other pads...
i know that i can use edrum10 to trigger VST like SD3 or others, just connect edrum10 and td27 to the computer and use midi learn to trigger pads/sound BUT... my primary intention is to trigger TD27 internal drumkit.

My td27 is full now and i use splitters to add 1 tom and 1 crash.

in one video review of edrum10 on youtube i read on the comment section that is not possible to ADD triggers to the td27 in standalone mode and that a lot of people have misunderstood this.

is this right ?.

thank you.

You are limited by the available zones of the TD-27 module. I was looking at the Roland TD-27 “Data List” in English page 57, and there is a total of 24 zones. Some of those I’m sure you don’t want to lose. Each of the zones have a unique assignable MIDI note. Here is an example of a benefit of the eDRUMin. If your playing style is such that you rarely play the bow of a crash, and the edge articulation is all you need. Connect the crashes to the eDRUMin instead of the TD-27 cable snake. Assign the TD-27 crash “rim” (which is the edge sound) MIDI note to both the bow and edge of the crash within the eDRUMin. Then assign a different instrument within the TD-27 module to the “head” (which is the bow). Now within the eDRUMin you assign the Td-27 crash’s head MIDI note to whatever pad you want. Benefit of this set up are 1) no cable splitters and 2) both zones of the crash still triggers albeit triggers the same edge sound. Same idea for the Toms and Aux inputs.

Another benefit of eDRUMin. I used to use a drum splitter to split a Tom into two toms. I had to live with inferior triggering on the “rim zone” additional Tom because Roland’s trigger adjustments for splitters is not 100%. A bit of give and take required to make both pads work. That’s because Roland doesn’t really assume or let you program triggering for head and rim as two entirely separate single zone pads. With eDRUMin you can dial in excellent triggering on both Toms, and not be forced to make sacrifices. eDRUMin allows each trigger input to be dialed in independently.

So by my count, if you don’t remove any Snare, Ride, Kick and HH zones, you are left with potential of 16 single zones to make a monster kit within the TD-27.

I forgot to mention another benefit of eDRUMin vs drum splitters. Within the eDRUMin you can create note banks. So for example if you “give up” the rim zone of a Tom or bow of a crash for additional pads. You can always create a note bank that keeps bow and edge MIDI notes for the standard Roland crashes, and/or head and rim MIDI notes for a standard Roland Tom or AUX. So you are just a footswitch away from turning your “expanded kit” back to the standard Roland kit size or anywhere in between.

So my own example. I split my time between VSTs and a slave TD-17 module. For the VST I use kits that are mostly three up and 2 down with a splash and a China cymbal (actually I have China set up in eDRUMin as a 2nd 3 zone ride). On the TD-17 I have VEX kits that I modified to have Aux=China and Tom 2 rim zone = Tom 4 head zone. I have not taken the time nor felt comfortable with my editing skills to do anything more than that. So my full kit has one extra ride cymbal, 1 extra rack Tom, and extra rim zones for each Tom 2 and Tom 4. However my note bank in eDRUMin that I use for TD-17 has the 2nd ride MiDi notes mirroring the 1st ride, extra rack Tom midi notes mirroring Tom 1, and the the rim zones for Tom 2 and Tom 4 are set to Tom 1 and Tom 3 rim MIDI notes, respectively. I couldn’t do all of that with drum splitters because it’s all hard wired. Now if I forget what I’m doing and hit the extra rack Tom while playing with TD-17 I don’t get a random sound or no sound, but Tom 1 sound plays so it doesn’t sound like I screwed up.

Personally I think the eDRUMin would help you get to where you want to be with better dynamics and more flexibility than if you tried to use drumsplitters.