eDRUMin version 2.3 BETA

[Rob]

Just wanted to add my voice to what AKA Wayne asked. I've been working with LV cymbals for awhile now and have had just enough success to keep me reaching for more. I was really excited when Rob added the high pass feature because for quite some time I've thought that some sort of software filtering would be the best way to tame these beasts, as mechanical dampening (filtering) creates undesirable side effects in volume/feel.
Rob, whenever you can get to it that would be cool. I suspect that more than a few metal cymbal guys would love to have this tool.

I don't think lowpass filtering is the solution. Perhaps rejecting the first 1.5 ms of data from a transient is a better option because it tends to be very high energy, especially when hitting anywhere near the peizo. I'll look into it at some point, but it's not high on my list of things to do.

[Mr_Bluesguy]

Understood. Thanks!

[AKA Wayne]

Just wanted to add my voice to what AKA Wayne asked. I've been working with LV cymbals for awhile now and have had just enough success to keep me reaching for more. I was really excited when Rob added the high pass feature because for quite some time I've thought that some sort of software filtering would be the best way to tame these beasts, as mechanical dampening (filtering) creates undesirable side effects in volume/feel.
Rob, whenever you can get to it that would be cool. I suspect that more than a few metal cymbal guys would love to have this tool.

I don't think lowpass filtering is the solution. Perhaps rejecting the first 1.5 ms of data from a transient is a better option because it tends to be very high energy, especially when hitting anywhere near the peizo. I'll look into it at some point, but it's not high on my list of things to do.

That sounds legit Rob! I know you are super busy and a one man show but I'd love to try on that feature.

[Inferior Drummer]

Here's build 12

New firmware with fixes and enhancements. My eD8 arrived today. (That makes 18 inputs! ) XMAS has come early! Thanks Rob!

Love this new feature and implementation so far. Other than hardly being able to see the black line showing unfiltered position on the crappy TV I'm using for a screen, but thats my problem

I can see it's going to take me a little while experimenting to figure out how to use this feature to my tastes, despite you clear description (sorry I'm a slow learner). I'm questioning my super loose hi-hat setup. I also hit rather hard, especially for edrums, making things worse.

I can see what you mean about the amount needed increasing as you get more closed. Mine starts peaking out at 100 easily in the last 30-40 CC range. But it seem to me that it isn't so much an issue there when the samples are so short?

Watching the effect in SD3, the HH CC and/or articulations tab, makes me realise how much odd behavior and artifacting I think I've gotten used to. I see how this feature is keeping the samples from 1 particular opening level playing much more consistency, without it the open levels could be moving 3 levels for me. But this got me thinking about how other options like the Openness Transition setting in SD3 and also your Fast Stepping feature might interact with each other. I only tried changing SD3 from Library Default to E-drum Optimized and yuk, the amount of long barks, missed/late pedal closings etc. I have also changed my open levels a bit in SD3 so that more of the CC range is used for the more closed levels, pushing all the others up a bit as I find the open 4-6 levels sound pretty similar, with more variation in sound the more closed it is. eg open 1 and 2 samples sound more different than 4 and 6. I'm guess I'm just overthinking (or under more like it) about all the various possible hi-hat setups and not knowing what you're fighting when making changes to a feature like this. I suppose you make the assumption people are using defaults.

As it is I think it does a good job of mitigating the problem and highlighting the issue in your own setup. As in showing how my loose hi-hats makes it worse. At the moment I can't stop transitions changing in the tight to open 1-2 range, ~100-127 in CC. But with the opens working well, and the closed being shorter sounds, I'm pretty happy with things as they are and tending to think my setup isn't helping. I hope to spend some time behind the kit this weekend.

In short (sorry for the rambling) I think the feature is great and wouldn't change anything without further feedback from others or findings from yourself. Unless you can magic something around that closed range of CC

(This was with build 11. I see it's 12 now and you changed what you wrote slightly, so hope I'm not wasting mine and your time)

Cheers.

[Rob]

In build 12 I added just a bit more filtering when the pedal gets close to completely closed. I have to be careful about adding too much filtering there because that's where the position needs the most definition. Thanks for the feedback. I think I will leave it as is now. It's already much improved.

[mrmbira]

My Alesis HiHat seems to be performing better when set to about 25 in the steady control. But haven't had a chance to play that much with it.

[Inferior Drummer]

My Alesis HiHat seems to be performing better when set to about 25 in the steady control.

Hehe, with my loose setup I have it at 100 and am still getting a bit of movement around the 3 most closed levels, but as I said because they are so short, I'm not really hearing anything problematic. And with the more open levels working so well, I'm loving being able to rock out with open/sloshy hats and no sample changes happening. My e-drums have never felt/sounded so normal and natural to play!

I'm curious though Rob,

I have to be careful about adding too much filtering there because that's where the position needs the most definition.

What exactly would be the problem with more filtering there? Like, would it fail to register small deliberate pedal position changes? Get stuck on a particular openness level despite pressing/lifting a bit?

I'm just struggling to think of another solution to the hi-hats triggering a sound when they hit the top of the travel on the stand without having it so loose it more comes to a rest. At the risk of getting too off-topic, I've been particularly keen on practicing keeping time with the left foot while playing on the ride/crash/toms etc, but if it's either 8th notes or a fast tempo, the foot ends up bouncing on and off the pedal and I would get alternating closed pedal and light fully open sounds triggering. Perhaps this is an issue I should be researching/asking elsewhere.

So, while I really am super happy with how things are at the moment, I'm just curious what the effect of too much filtering would be like.

Also, a probably silly thought, but a possible solution to triggering when hitting top of travel, yet another Magic Rob (tm) feature added. A filter that rejects triggering when under a certain value when the hi-hat CC is at or around fully open? It would mean light hits at fully open wouldn't trigger, but still. Just a thought. It really is behaving very well as it is.

Thanks as always Rob.

[Rob]

The problem you are having is that you don't have your hihat setup on its stand properly. You need to make sure that the top hihat cymbal is always in contact with the plunger. This is mentioned in my videos. Basically, lowering your top hat a bit and recalibrating will fix the issue.

[Inferior Drummer]

Oh yeah, it is setup like that. It's the abrupt stop the pad comes to from hitting the end of travel of the HH stand, if I'm describing that correctly. I'm no expert and have hardly messed around with all the adjustments available on the stand.
This was never really a problem before trying to do fast chicks and was something I put up for a while before going very loose.

Perhaps after putting up with so many compromises with e-drums, then having you fix so many of them has spoiled me

Edit: like, to get the HH pad to stop before leaving the plunger, does it not hit an hard end to the travel when set like that, making it trigger? unless it's super loose. Sorry if just being an annoying dumb arse.

[Rob]

It *should* filter hihat hits when the pedal abruptly stops on the way up. Can you post the settings for your hihat cymbal? Also, on my hihat setup, I wouldn't say the hihat cymbal abruptly stops. I'd say it oscillates up and down quickly before coming to a rest.