Snare throw off switch

[Sly]

Yes I thought also that it's doable this way; but I think there's still on thing missing in your post Mylo. What about the snare bleed ? If you have some bleed for the snare wire (almost everybody use it I guess), you still have this bleed if you just change the snare midi notes. All the toms and the kick will still bleed in the snare bottom mic (the one with the snare wire on).

It's still doable I think, using the macro of SD3 but that's not simple anymore. And it could requires eDRUMin to send a CC when the Snare throw off switch is activated...
It seems that the Macro controls in SD3 can respond to hardware CC.

[Mylo]

Yes I thought also that it's doable this way; but I think there's still on thing missing in your post Mylo. What about the snare bleed ? If you have some bleed for the snare wire (almost everybody use it I guess), you still have this bleed if you just change the snare midi notes. All the toms and the kick will still bleed in the snare bottom mic (the one with the snare wire on).

It's still doable I think, using the macro of SD3 but that's not simple anymore. And it could requires eDRUMin to send a CC when the Snare throw off switch is activated...
It seems that the Macro controls in SD3 can respond to hardware CC.

You should be able to go to the mixer and for this X-Snare Disable Bleed from All Instruments and see if that is helps.

Well it seems you can’t set the Bleed options on an X- type drum. This doesn’t seem right. Might have to dig the manual out.

[Sly]

What I mean is when you have two snares (one with snare wire on, and anther X-drum with snare wire off), you indeed can trigger the one with the snare wires off (no need to disable the bleed, because there's no wires...).
But when you paly your tom or your kick, SD3 will still trigger the bleed samples of the main snare drum, and then you'll here the snare wires.
Of course you can disable the bleed of the main snare, but you don't really want it if you're after something natural.

[Mylo]

I’m understanding you now…

Snare is for snare on.
X-Snare is for snare off.

When playing X-Snare the Snare wire bleed is still on so we are hearing them.

I know in SD3 every macro can be assigned a CC and be controlled from outside sources. Is seems it would be possible to write a macro to set it all up and then trigger that macro from eDRUMin. Which is what you suggested earlier.

If SD3 would just give us snare off articulations it would be so simple. This seems like a glaring oversight to me. I know if I was a drummer at these recordings I would have definitely asked the question: What about snare off articulations?

[jacko]

I’m understanding you now…

Snare is for snare on.
X-Snare is for snare off.

When playing X-Snare the Snare wire bleed is still on so we are hearing them.

I know in SD3 every macro can be assigned a CC and be controlled from outside sources. Is seems it would be possible to write a macro to set it all up and then trigger that macro from eDRUMin. Which is what you suggested earlier.

If SD3 would just give us snare off articulations it would be so simple. This seems like a glaring oversight to me. I know if I was a drummer at these recordings I would have definitely asked the question: What about snare off articulations?

from the perspective of toontrack and the team doing the sampling (and also for drummers using the vst), when you have a drum with the snare off, you want rim shot, side stick, centre, rim etc articulations. if you have 'snare off' as an articulation rather than as a separate instrument you can't do that.

doesn't help solve the problem but does explain why it's recorded this way and set up this way in the software

EDIT:
for example, on this recording i used a 'snare off' instrument as the main snare. you can see i used a few different articulations that wouldn't be possible if 'snare off' was set up in the software as an articulation in a 'regular' snare

https://youtu.be/gFn0lbidg_E

[Mylo]

Nice playing jacko. Very nice.

When I say “snare off articulation” I mean for Toontrack to record all permutations. An articulation for all those you mentioned with snare on and with snare off. The snare is a vital part of the kit and articulation wise should be treated with the abundance of articulations like the hi-hat.

So your snare would end up with 10 articulations.

Center - snare on, snare off
Rim - snare on, snare off
Etc..

The trick would then be to turn off the bleed from the toms when you have snares off.

[jacko]

Superior Drummer tip: to decrease kit load times turn off all articulations that your kit doesn’t use. No sense loading an articulation you are not using. For example: cymbals usually have both bell and bow shank loaded. But a cymbal pad can’t differentiate between a shank or tip hit so in SD3 pick which articulation you want for a bell hit and turn off the other one.

turning off articulations you won't use is good advice. but you can stack tip and shank articulations on bell and bow and trigger the shanks with higher velocity hits to up the dynamics.

if you want to.

https://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced/v ... ost1218461

[Mylo]

Superior Drummer tip: to decrease kit load times turn off all articulations that your kit doesn’t use. No sense loading an articulation you are not using. For example: cymbals usually have both bell and bow shank loaded. But a cymbal pad can’t differentiate between a shank or tip hit so in SD3 pick which articulation you want for a bell hit and turn off the other one.

turning off articulations you won't use is good advice. but you can stack tip and shank articulations on bell and bow and trigger the shanks with higher velocity hits to up the dynamics.

if you want to.

https://www.vdrums.com/forum/advanced/v ... ost1218461

I’ve done this on my rides. I stack them and use velocity gates in SD3 to control which articulation is played. It gets a little complicated to explain so I left that part out in my tip

[monospace]

I’ve asked a related question on vdrums.com and the consensus was that SD3 only has snare buzz in the bleed channels (of the bottom mic) of the main snare. You can set up a secondary snare as an X-Drum (as I have) but it will not have any buzz in its bleed channels.

(Also, the buzz in the main snare’s bleed is the same regardless of which particular snare you have selected. This makes sense because recording this for each snare and each instrument bleed would be prohibitive and besides, you wouldn’t be able to tell the difference.)

Back to your question. You can indeed set up a macro to turn off all the bleeds in the Bottom Snare microphone. And you can assign this macro to a midi switch. But you will have to play your “snares off” snare as an X-Drum, because SD3 cannot swap out instruments on the fly with macros. If you use a dual switch on the eDrumIn, you could assign one switch to the SD3 macro, and the other to the midi mapping of your trigger.

[jacko]

Nice playing jacko. Very nice.

thanks Mylo - appreciate that

When I say “snare off articulation” I mean for Toontrack to record all permutations. An articulation for all those you mentioned with snare on and with snare off. The snare is a vital part of the kit and articulation wise should be treated with the abundance of articulations like the hi-hat.

So your snare would end up with 10 articulations.

Center - snare on, snare off
Rim - snare on, snare off
Etc..

The trick would then be to turn off the bleed from the toms when you have snares off.

toontrack do offer this for some snares (not nearly enough in my opinion, but there are a few). but these are in the respective libraries as separate instruments. so if you set up a kit with one snare-on drum, and one snare-off drum, you still get the bleed on the snare-on drum.

My point is that designing the vst with 'snare off' as an articulation instead of as a separate instrument would be a serious limitation. an artefact of this design tho is the bleed and rattle in the snare-on drum

EDIT:

i just re-read your post.

it was inaccurate of me to say 'toontrack do offer this with some snares'. it would be more accurate to say they offer snare-on and snare-off instruments that sample the same snares in a few cases.

if they set it up the way you suggest for every snare that would indeed be ideal.