Yamaha woes

[perceval]

I have all Yamaha cymbals, crashes, ride and HH.

I have tried the TCS pads, and... well, I hated the silicon feel.
Daniel, I believe, on the VDrums site mentioned it felt like hitting wet overcooked noodles. That's pretty much how I feel.
I have a rubber pad that is based on the older TP Yamaha pads, which works well. If I could find a set of the old TP pads in my corner of the world, I would gladly go for it.

So, I have to settle on DIY simple crossbar design. But, the Yamaha scheme does not work well with DIY or regular Roland style pads.
When Rob and his eDRUMin device showed up, it was the solution to get great snare and toms triggering, without being tied to just Yamaha pads that I didn't like, and let's face it, kinda expensive as well!

It started with the ED4, to add the snare and toms full compatibility to the DTX700, using a MIDI cable to link the two together.
At first it was just triggering the DTX700 own sounds, but I had been bitten by the VST bug, and soon, it was almost 100% VST sounds.

Since I was going only VST, having a module was kinda overkill, and then the ED10 showed up.
The DTX700 was put aside, and I never looked back.

I kept the module as a back up, and to test the ED4/ED10 using it.... but the eDRUMin devices have been so reliable, I don't feel the need to keep it, so I'll probably try to sell the module in the near future.

[gravyface]

Excellent. I may be bending your ear on here if that's cool.

What VSTs are you using?

[gravyface]

Hats are still not working properly. Snare good, ride good. I can't find the calibration video on YouTube; there is one for VH-10/11, but not sure if that's what you mean.

Everything's into the DTX 700 direct except hi-hat controller/pad, snare, ride.

I have 3-zone cymbal selected, ran calibration (can't find the video, so just clicked Calibrate and then hit around on the hi-hats at different speed/weight, etc.).

Did the same on the pedal, which was auto-sense (not sure which foot pedal icon it should be selecting, but it's showing the first one; tried the other too). Forced Yamaha wiring. Calibrated, linked to hi-hats.

Hi-hat bow seems to work fine, no edge, which seems to always hit bow unless I really crank it, then it triggers a bell, but a Casio keyboard circa 1989 bell sound. Hi-hat pedal just triggers the closed sound, no splash (which I never do, so whatever), but cannot trigger the hi-hat open sound.

[perceval]

I'm about to head out camping for a day or two, so, I might not be able to help you too much in the short time.
I'm using SD3.

Do you have a DIN cable to link the ED4 to the DTX700?

Are you still trying to get SSD5 sounds?
If yes, take it out of the equation for now, and just trigger DTX700 sounds.

9 times out of ten, when I have triggering woes, it's the cable.
Check that the cable plugs are fully in.
Wiggle the space between the TRS plug and the cable... does it trigger anything? If yes, there's a loose connection.
Swap the cable between a good pad like your snare or ride, and the HH... Still have issues?

I don't use pedal sense. I just click on the variable pedal icon. I'm not swapping out pedals all the time, so one less thing to worry.
Press on the pedal... does the green bar move up and down smoothly from 0 to 127? If yes, it's working fine, and the trouble lies elsewhere, most likely in the VST as they can be tricky to set up the HH properly in there. I've had my hair pulling sessions trying to get SD3 to perform as I expected it to be. That's why you should start with triggering the module only before attempting going to VST.

Good luck, catch you again in a couple days!

[gravyface]

I'm jealous of the camping trip.

Yes, I'm just into the DTX 700 right now, and just using snare and hi-hat (pad/controller) to keep it simple (stupid).

Before I sink any more time into eDRUMin with my DTX 700 kit, what benefits should I be expecting here vs. direct to the DTX 700 module?

I sheepishly just realized that positional sensing is only going to work on mesh piezo pads (pro tip kids: RTFM), so that's kind of a bummer. Still, you seem pretty amped about eDRUMin with your DTX kit.

[perceval]

Back a little early from the trip. It was soooo windy! No surfing possible.

Yep, I'm lucky to live in a place that is basically COVID free, so no restrictions around here.

Using the DTX700 as sound module, you will not get much using the ED4 as trigger to the DTX. A bit more definition in dynamics, but since most pads are limited to 3 sounds according to velocities, not much gain there.
The biggest plus is that you can use any pad from any manufacturer to trigger the DTX, and not just Yamaha. To me, this was gold, meaning I could use DIY pads and still get the Yamaha 3 zones, without shelling out for the mushy Yamaha pads.

I was mostly saying you should make sure all MIDI data trigger the right sounds in the module, before attempting to mesh it out to another MIDI map with a VST.
Using the eDRUMin app, make sure you get head, rim click and rim shot right on the snare (yeah.. no PS with the DTX), all 3 zones on the HH cymbal and ride (assuming you have the PCY135 and 155) show up and triggering in the app.

Then, connecting the DTX, make sure each zone hit has the right MIDI data and triggers the right sound in the DTX.

After that, you can add the extra layer of the VST sounds... and hoping the Yamaha map in SSD5 is accurate.

[gravyface]

Ok, so I have some work to do then:

The hi-hat pedal close is extremely hot: way too much gain. I tried the RHH 135 and the RHH 65 and both are similar.

The hi-hat Bow seems fine, when closed, but triggering Edge requires a lot of force which also seems to trigger the Bell, which sounds like the bell on the built in DTX 700 click track (first beat of the bar).

And then I read the specs and the RHH135 is just a two-zone pad: Bow and Edge, so going to try that.

Any idea on the super hot hi-hat close pedal?

[perceval]

Did you play a lot with the DTX700 settings? or buy it 2nd hand?
Might be good to do a factory reset, just in case some settings were altered to throw things off...

DTX700 Factory Reset
Press the [MENU] button.
Turn the [DIAL] to move the cursor to “Utility”.
Press the [DIAL].
Turn the [DIAL] to move the cursor to “FactSet”.
Press the [DIAL].
Press the [F3] button. You will be asked to confirm that you wish to restore the Factory Set. ...
Press the [DIAL] to restore the Factory Set.

And, when you say the HH closed is hot, is it the pedal that is too sensitive or the sound when hitting the HH with a stick is too loud?

If you could show a video screen grab of the eDRUMin window while you are hitting the pad, we might see something to check.

[gravyface]

Did you play a lot with the DTX700 settings? or buy it 2nd hand?
Might be good to do a factory reset, just in case some settings were altered to throw things off...

DTX700 Factory Reset
Press the [MENU] button.
Turn the [DIAL] to move the cursor to “Utility”.
Press the [DIAL].
Turn the [DIAL] to move the cursor to “FactSet”.
Press the [DIAL].
Press the [F3] button. You will be asked to confirm that you wish to restore the Factory Set. ...
Press the [DIAL] to restore the Factory Set.

And, when you say the HH closed is hot, is it the pedal that is too sensitive or the sound when hitting the HH with a stick is too loud?

If you could show a video screen grab of the eDRUMin window while you are hitting the pad, we might see something to check.

Did a factory reset already.

I've moved onto SSD 5.5, to see how it sounds there; had to do some re-assigning, but it's about where it was before, when I ran direct into DTX 700 and then triggered hi-hats in SSD 5.5.

I still don't like the hat responsiveness/playability compared to direct into the DTX 700, but that has never translated to SSD 5.5, so that's a wash basically.

I wish I could get my hands on some different hats to try, but for now, I'm going to back to acoustic hi-hats and miking it.

I've heard that SD3 is superior (no pun intended) with it's triggering, but information on the RHH135 is slim, and I'm hesitant to pumping ~550 CAD into another drum VST that doesn't trigger well from the Yamaha.

[perceval]

no need to spend the cash.

EZDrummer2 has a free 10-day demo.
It has the same HH engine as SD3. So you can try the HH response with it.

I think I remember others saying they had trouble dialing the SSD5 HH.

Anyway, give EZD2 a try, see if it fares better.

https://www.toontrack.com/ezdrummer-2-1 ... o-version/